Mia Fileman 0:05
Life’s too short for crap marketing.
The “Got Marketing?” Podcast is for marketers, business owners, and entrepreneurs who want marketing that’s fun, accessible, and meaningful.
Join me, Mia Fileman, for inspired chats with my favourite marketing insiders about marketing that works; campaigns that inspire; and the fads, fakery, and false prophets to avoid.
Welcome, friend!
Today, we’re going to discuss making the intangible tangible – taking a seed of an idea and bringing it to life. I don’t know about you, but seeing ideas come to life is the most rewarding part of my job.
So, you think you’ve got a good idea? What happens next.
“You can always start everything on your own and do everything on your own. A lot of the work that we do, and a lot of the work that a lot of people do is that, but then there has to be an element of backing yourself, believing yourself, and playing big. To do that, even the best coaches in the world have coaches.”
That was Frances Chnaider, the Co-Founder of Awesome Source – a non-alcoholic G&T brand.
Alcohol consumption is declining worldwide with young people driving this cultural shift. Enter the zero-alcohol beverages market that looks and tastes like alcohol. The pandemic has accelerated the growth of zero-alcohol beverages. In 2022, the zero-alcohol market was valued at 11 billion dollars.
While the zero-percent category is still in its infancy, non-alcohol is growing faster than alcohol in most markets. With increased demand comes increased opportunity, so let’s dive into the chat with Frances and find out how she took Awesome Source from idea to execution.
Welcome to “Got Marketing?” Frances!
Frances Chnaider 2:00
Hey, Mia! Super excited to be here!
Mia Fileman 2:04
I’m so thrilled I finally got you here. It took a little bit of doing.
Why the apprehension?
Frances Chnaider 2:11
It’s always different when you’re doing a podcast. We get requests like this a little bit. I’ve done a little feature article this week, too. I guess I spend so much time planning, preparing, and doing – awesome and good.
But when you’re actually given the space to then discuss it, it’s such a different vibe and experience. You’re having to step back up out of things, dissect, and be really vulnerable.
Everyone who knows me knows that I’m always super authentic – sometimes to a fault – being direct and happy to talk through reality. It’s a different ballgame speaking to the Mia and doing it about me.
Mia Fileman 2:54
Yes, but on the other side of fear is growth, right?
Frances Chnaider 2:58
You’re talking to a Tony Robbins seminar veteran, chatting about personal development growth, kicking fear directly in the face. I think Lady Gaga made a really good quote. She said, “I felt fear, and I got into my green room, and I kicked it in the face.”
I am an absolutely huge fan of all those philosophies, but beyond that, living and breathing that in real life, too – not just the theory.
Mia Fileman 3:21
I love that. That’s so good.
I would say it took a lot of balls of steel to create a zero-alcohol brand. I want to talk about it.
First of all, why? Why did you create a zero-alcohol brand?
Frances Chnaider 3:34
Everyone’s got an epic fuck-off origin story, right? We can sit here and talk about every single micro moment that happened to build this up. I have that story, and we absolutely can do that.
The crux of it all is I’m a girl who knows that she has epic potential to do good for the world. When I look back on my life when it’s coming to an end, I want to say I spent my time, my energy, and my greatness on something that is worthwhile, bigger than me, and doing good for the world.
A lot of my career has been in doing sometimes very little about lots of reward in other capacities and other ways, but Awesome Source to me is about helping people live their best lives, particularly those that are looking to do it unapologetically with boldness and with lack of fear.
Everything else that amounted to that moment, we can absolutely chat through, but the bottom line is that is why I started Awesome Source, and that is why it’s called Awesome Source. You don’t see references to AF. You don’t see references to alcohol-free in my brand name. We are more than that.
Mia Fileman 4:50
I love that. I love that you’ve put purpose ahead of everything. You’re living a life of purpose and living a life of intention. But why did you channel it specifically to zero-alcohol G&T? What was it about that that appealed to you the most?
Frances Chnaider 5:05
The truth is that I used to drink a lot.
Come over to my house, you are welcome any time. I know it’s a bit of a trip from Darwin to Melbourne, but you’re here occasionally, so come on over, girlfriend. My cabinet of alcohol is crazy. Talk about spending money on artisanal gin products? That was me.
I think a lot of people spend a lot of their time really loving alcohol. It’s part of our social fabric. My background is European. We were drinking right at an early age. It was incredibly normal for me to drink a lot. Have a glass of wine with dinner.
The reality is that it got to a point where I actually started to get headaches. The decision for me to drink significantly changed and became very apparent that it was right or wrong. I was having side effects.
All of a sudden, my collection of hundreds of dollars’ worth of beautiful gin products felt like they were occupying a space within my house that I wanted to indulge and wanted to enjoy but it wasn’t worth it.
Awesome Source became a product that I wanted to consume – something that was beautiful and glamourous. Last night, someone on Instagram called it “bougie.” I’m not sure if that’s the right term because that’s not my intention – to be bougie – but I definitely wanted to create something that I felt was similar to that artisanal gin – really bespoke, premium, lux, and made me feel special.
Headaches became a big part of the reason why I started a non-alcohol business, Mia.
Mia Fileman 6:38
I love how honest and upfront you have been about that because I think it is everyone’s lived experience, but no one is talking about it – that actually alcohol is not helping us live our best lives. We are in denial of it because of what you said about it being part of the social fabric.
I also think you made such a good point around how, as you get older, you start to really question, “Is it worth it? Is it worth spending my entire weekend hungover, grumpy, yelling at my kids to have not that many drinks on Friday night?” As we get older, alcohol does not agree with us.
Frances Chnaider 7:18
Yes, and I think a lot of Australians – and lot of people around the world – have already discovered the health benefits of not drinking alcohol. It’s also a strategic choice of Awesome Source – of Ben and I – to not necessarily spend a lot of time discussing the health benefits because I think people know about the benefits of reducing your alcohol intake.
Having said that, I have become a mum. It is not worth spending my weekend hungover. Most importantly, I don’t want to be missing moments.
You know how, when you drink alcohol, you feel like you turn into a different version? Sometimes, it’s a great version; sometimes, it’s not. The reality is the fact that I turned into a different version bothered me. It really bothered me.
Why did I need alcohol to feel like I could be funnier, or I could be more open, or more affectionate? I’m a very happy drunk. I feel like that was a very weird scenario for me – to sit back and reflect, “I had a few glasses of mine, and now I’m this different person.”
I really like who I am. I think a lot of people genuinely do like who I am. Sometimes, we struggle with who we are, and sometimes we are not in the best position to really appreciate ourselves.
Ultimately, I think there is so much appreciation that we do have for who we are, our uniqueness, and our awesomeness. Again, the name Awesome Source within you. “Yes, I want to avoid the hangovers. Yes, I want to avoid the headaches. But I also want to be me and be someone who loves me.”
Mia Fileman 8:43
Zero-alcohol is having a moment. I’ve had this discussion with my husband.
Why would you want non-alcohol that tastes like alcohol but doesn’t give you the buzz? Can you talk us through the rationale around making zero-alcohol products that still taste like alcohol?
Frances Chnaider 9:02
That’s a great question. The bigger this category is getting, the more subsegments are emerging.
Some non-alcoholic products are designed to fully replicate the alcohol experience. There are some great brands that really deliver to that. Some brands are inspired by alcohol, creating their own version. They are not necessarily looking to identically imitate what you would experience and deliver that in their version.
There is an entire new breed of drinks that are calling themselves non-alcohol because they don’t have any alcohol in them, but they are a completely different product. They are not even trying to be – say for example – a negroni or a gin and tonic.
There are three kinds of core segments – all of them are targeting very different occasions and very different people. Sometimes, it’s the same people, but different people on different journeys, e.g., you are starting to drink less alcohol, but you bloody love a gin and tonic.
You also really love a bespoke experience. You love the nuances of artisanal gins. You love the botanicals. Awesome Source – we are for you. You are looking at having a similar experience, but something that is different.
Because you like food, you like experimenting, you are a foodie, that is the perfect scenario for Awesome Source. You also might be someone looking to cut back alcohol but really loves the taste and the burn factor of a cocktail. There are plenty of brands that deliver that.
It really depends on where you are at in the journey.
Others just don’t like alcohol at all and they’re looking for a cool drink. In that case, you’re not looking for the replica. You’re not looking for the burn. You’re not looking for any of that. You’re not even looking for a cocktail or a beer or a wine. You’re just looking for something else. That’s that third subsegment that I referred to.
Wholistically answering your question, and maybe even a little bit more than you bargained for, if you will, there are different non-alcohols all for different purposes; different people; and, most importantly, even the same person on a different part of their journey.
Mia Fileman 10:58
That was fantastic! Thank you so much for stepping us through that!
As a marketing nerd, I love when someone talks dirty to me about customer segments. It tickles me pink!
Frances Chnaider 11:09
I know! I knew it tickles your pickle! I feel the same!
I had a really great conversation yesterday about data. I was stepping this person through data. They were like, “I’m also a data nerd!” I’m like, “Fantastic! Let’s talk about shopper category insights. Let’s go through what the data is saying sales-wise!”
Mia Fileman 11:28
I love that!
Talk us through a timeline of events from having the idea to full-blown manufacturing of this Awesome Source.
Frances Chnaider 11:40
Like every startup, it takes forever to really get to where you want to go, and you’re still always perfecting and implementing that continuous and never-ending improvement philosophy.
I said earlier that I am a subscriber to Tony Robbins. A lot of people know him – if they do, they either love him or hate him. Regardless of your opinion, he has absolutely played a huge role in changing my life – and Ben’s – and there’s a number of reasons why, but that’s for a different podcast on another day.
After jumping up and down for five fucking nights, 14-hour or 16-hour days, on a business seminar of his – anyone who’s done Tony Robbins will get this – you are up literally in the opposite time zone. You’re getting up at midnight until about 2:00, 3:00, 4:00, 5:00 p.m. for four to six days straight, depending on the seminar, having constant content and NLP exercises and everything else.
After that, you cannot leave that experience without making some life-changing altering decision. Mine was starting a business with Ben. I turned to him like, “Babe, we have to start this business.” On the wall, Mia, prior to this, I already had quite a few ideas of which businesses interested me. One of them was non-alcohol. I had plastered the wall behind our screen with all these ideas. It was a virtual event.
One clearly stood out to me which was non-alcohol drinks. That was the one that I think amplified six days of crazy hours and all the Tony Robbins. That felt the one that needed our attention the most and also solved a key problem of mine.
I turned to Ben. “Let’s start a business! You’re a rocket scientist. I’m a whatever – insert here. Let’s do it. Let’s combine our two different sizes of brains, combine forces, and make this happen.” He said no. He literally said to me, “I don’t want to start a business with you.”
Maybe you can also get the vibe from this podcast that I am very passionate. I love doing things. I thrive off momentum. I suspect that not everybody wants to start a business with a personality type like that. On the flip side, you get a lot of greatness from that passion.
Eventually, like in all of those circumstances, Mia, he objected and then compromised and said yes. That was the start of what I felt was going to be the most incredible experience and partnership.
Again, for another podcast – starting a business with your partner and your baby daddy is hard. It is not easy. It is not for the faint-hearted. It is a question that we discuss many times a week around how we still work together, how we still live together, how we raise a baby together.
This is where that passion side comes in. After that, it took so many months and trying to get anyone to help us. We believe in getting the best help that we can get so that we can make the best products. Most people said no. This bushy-haired bright-eyed rose-coloured glasses Frances sat on call after call with people who didn’t want to help us. We were too new or too small or didn’t know what we were doing.
Mia Fileman 14:56
What kind of help were you looking for at that stage?
Frances Chnaider 14:59
We were really looking for someone to support us from a consultancy and coaching perspective. Basically, becoming an extension of our team and helping us create a business that was playing big. It wasn’t “let’s create a really cute product” and then see what happens.
It was “how do we make this into a business that has legs, that can win in conversations with big accounts, women in commerce, and really stand out and develop something authentic but also something commercial?”
Mia Fileman 15:29
I love that you started with a strategy that was like, “First, we want to nail the value proposition before we’ve even started mixing drinks.”
Frances Chnaider 15:38
Yes, I think we took that angle because you can always start everything on your own and do everything on your own. A lot of the work that we do, and a lot of the work that a lot of people do is that. But there has to be an element of backing yourself, believing yourself, and playing big. To do that, even the best coaches in the world have coaches. We really believed in ourselves that we were worthy of that support.
Finally, after a billion calls, once we got that yes from a group of people who actually headed up and founded Thankyou, they were incredible with us. I think they saw that we were passionate and that we were going to make this happen regardless and we just needed a bit of assistance.
We got that yes and started the process. Ben bought everything that he could to build a custom distillation in our dining table in the middle of renovation in COVID. He distilled everything he could find and built the flavour base for our product. That’s how Awesome Source was born.
Mia Fileman 16:31
Amazing. So good!
I love that it was Thankyou that helped you. They are one of my absolute all-time favourite brands. I’m happy to hear that what happens behind the scenes also reflects what you see on the outside. They are a brand that loves to do good in all aspects of how they present in the world.
Frances Chnaider 16:52
We were really aligned in our thinking.
Awesome Source is predicated and very grounded in the idea of doing good. We’re like a high-fashion, high-vibe, but good-vibe and good-intention brand. A lot of our philosophy is giving, generosity, and kindness. We had a huge component about it when we started strategically – one that we will eventuate, and one that we will do on a bigger scale – that really aligned us with these incredible people.
Mia Fileman 17:18
Great!
From dining room table, what does your manufacturing look like now?
I don’t know if you know this about me, but I actually grew up around factories, so I find this really fascinating. What’s your setup now? Where is it made?
Frances Chnaider 17:31
We couldn’t physically bottle Awesome Source from our kitchen bench. Aside from the highly illegal aspect of it, it also wasn’t something that we could scale, and we really wanted to make sure that we were setting ourselves up for the future.
I think there are a lot of brands who start in their kitchen, make things, it’s delicious and tasty, and when it’s time for growth and they get that account, it’s one in a hundred stores to have your product in there. They’re not really sure how they can supply that.
A lot of that philosophy, we really tried to navigate right at the beginning. We started with one bottler who took us on. Everyone else said no, of course. Fun fact – we decided to use an imported glass bottle because why would you use a can when everyone else is using a can? This is our marketing and USP, right? Let’s do something different.
We imported a unique glass bottle to bottle it, but nobody wanted to work with us because of the unknown quantity and the risks associated with that. We moved on from there when we were using another bottling company that is incredibly beautiful and a family-owned business, but we have the ingredients that we procure. We currently work with another person to support us in the development of the flavours and the recipes then we have that bottled through a third party.
Yes, it’s quite a process. I have to admit that was one of the biggest learning curves. How do you actually bring a food product to life? What are the accreditations? What’s required? Shelf-life testing? Microbe testing? Name it. It’s another thing to learn and another thing to get done.
Mia Fileman 19:06
Totally.
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What kind of market research or competitor research did you do?
Because now there’s quite a few non-alcohol brands. Like you said, playing in all sorts of different markets, you’ve got zero-alcohol beer, you’ve got zero-alcohol or low-alcohol wine, you’ve got pre-mixes like yours. What was your process of mapping where you would fit in the market?
Frances Chnaider 20:18
Great question.
For everyone who has a marketing background, you understand customer research, market research, surveys, and focus groups. You also understand that a lot of what people say isn’t necessarily exactly what they’re going to do.
Purchase intent versus actually buying behaviour can often be two very different things.
For me, I started with all the theory and the research. I would interview anyone that wasn’t drinking alcohol and I would write notes like crazy about what they would say. There was one moment where I was at my six-month dental checkup. It turned out that the dentist didn’t drink alcohol.
After my hygiene appointment, I interviewed my dentist on all things about why he didn’t drink and figured the insights from there. I would be that mad woman who would talk and talk and talk.
I eventually found really beautiful macro themes that made very clear sense into the space that we wanted to play and created prototypes. I would create so many designs about packaging. Honestly, between you and I and now the rest of the universe, they were all pretty shit because I thought about the packaging design at the same time as everything else.
Eventually, we created our product and got it. Stood at market. Still stand at markets and events. I would spend hours and hours and hours to figure out what they like and what they don’t like. Every product we had ever done, we would tweak the flavour, we would increase this element, we would put juniper, et cetera, through the basis of what actually has now emerged product-wise, but everything was predicated in an intense amount of chatting, scribbling, and drawing out the big things that came out.
To close off the response, my customers want the spectacle – a beautiful cocktail experience. We are talking the cocktail glass, the garnish, the vibe.
Hence, that is why Awesome Source looks the way it looks. That is why we are not in a can at the moment. That is why we are in black-and-white packaging. That is why we really developed this story and that overall customer experience that we deliver. That all came from our insights.
Mia Fileman 22:33
That’s fabulous. I love how it’s more ceremonial.
Frances Chnaider 22:36
Yes.
Mia Fileman 22:37
It’s an elevated customer experience.
It’s like, “Why can’t I go out and have a good time and have a beautiful drink that doesn’t have alcohol in it? I have it in a beautiful glass, and I have it with a beautiful garnish.” I think that’s fabulous.
Frances Chnaider 22:52
It’s the very basis of everything product-wise and experience-wise.
When you receive an order from us, it comes in a custom black-and-white bold carton. Inside, you receive our products. Most of the time, you get a Polaroid with a personal written message from Ben and I. Likely, you are going to get garnishes, and you are going to get all of these beautiful things.
That is just as fundamental to me as the liquid in the product – the ingredients. The whole experience needs to be considered because our customers are discerning, so we are discerning for them.
Mia Fileman 23:29
Yes, I have received one of these incredible packages from you. I have to say, it is absolutely chef’s kiss in terms of customer experience and every little detail considered. I’m here for it, for sure.
You are not for 100-percent sobriety in your messaging. What is your position?
Frances Chnaider 23:53
Our take is that, if you have a challenging relationship with alcohol – and that can be challenging in many different ways – we believe that even Awesome Source isn’t for you. It’s a point where we sit firmly.
If alcohol or anything related to alcohol is something that is sensitive or triggering or challenging for you, that is a different conversation. That is the need for sobriety.
I think we as a brand very much have most of our customers sitting in a space of what is traditionally called “switchers” or customers who switch – people who drink alcohol but are looking to “moderate” or are looking to have a better-for-you alternative. Those people don’t necessarily have a challenging relationship with alcohol.
Our customers enjoy a cocktail, enjoy a wine, enjoy a beer. We want them to enjoy their lives how they see fit and really be a no-judgment brand, so we are really separating ourselves.
For our customers, live your best life. Eat that pasta. Fuck it. Pile on that goddamn parmesan high. How about a slice of cake? How about a cocktail?
When you are looking for a better product for your health because that might be a health-related decision that you’re making. Or it might be a moment. Let’s say you’re going to a barbeque and it’s a really hot day. You know that yuck feeling when you’re getting drunk in a hot environment? Or it’s a Thursday night. Or you’re going somewhere and it’s your first drink or the second drink of the night and you don’t want to have four alcoholic ones so you’re splitting. That’s where we come in.
That’s our messaging. That’s something that we believe is fundamental to have very little judgment for our customers.
Mia Fileman 25:37
That’s awesome – pardon the pun.
As I was researching for this podcast, I found that the zero-alcohol market has this whole vernacular that I’m wrapping my head around. I think what you’ve described has a term – tiger striping. Have you heard this?
Frances Chnaider 25:54
Yes, I have.
Mia Fileman 25:56
Some days, they have alcohol. Some days, they have no alcohol. Some days, they have low alcohol. Some days, like you said, they might start with two non-alcoholic drinks and then finish the night with a gin and tonic. I love it. I think it’s all about balance.
Interestingly, I spoke to the founder of Heaps Normal on a masterclass that I was running – an event around campaigns for social impact. He wasn’t actually the founder. Sorry. He was the marketing director – Timothy Snape of Heaps Normal.
He said that they got a body of research that said that, after Dry July, people end up binging alcohol. They stop drinking for a month then they binge. It’s so counterproductive to do that. What if you could balance every day as opposed to this all-or-nothing whiplash that you get?
Frances Chnaider 26:54
Yes, but it’s a weird one.
Sometimes, someone will go up to me and say, “It’s Dry July!” or “It’s Feb Fast. I’m not drinking. I’ll buy some Awesome Source.” I always have that conversation with them about their next steps and why they’re not drinking for a month but then potentially drinking later.
It’s really your decision how you live your life and what makes sense for you. The alternative of non-alcohol should be a permanent alternative – no matter what month it is. I think we have a job to do in also promoting drinking less alcohol as a better-for-you choice but making sure it’s not monthly or on a calendar-type situation.
Another example is I got a call from my chiropractor the other day. The phone call started like, “Hey, Frances! This month is Customer Appreciation Month!” My first thought was, “Why we do only have a month dedicated to valuing your customers? This should be a daily practice.”
I fully understand where they’re coming from and how they believe that they’re doing the right thing. I completely get it. But that was my thought, and it’s a similar thought around having a dedicated period in the year that you don’t drink versus just living a lifestyle that – to your point – is either based on moderation or that suits you.
For me, I have a zag and a zig day or a cheat day. Most of the week, I am eating relatively healthy. Sometimes, I even give myself a pass. I’m bloody human. But my other day – my cheat day or my zag day – ugh! If I want chocolate cake, if I want pizza, fuck it! If I want a croissant for breakfast, pizza for lunch, and a burger for dinner, I am not denying myself that pleasure. That’s my lifestyle choice.
That’s my sustainable lifestyle choice, and I’ve been doing that for a number of years.
Mia Fileman 28:40
I feel you’re more gracious than I am with the Customer Appreciation Month. I’m like, “I’m sorry. That makes no sense to me whatsoever that you would make that call.” I would have been so indignant and be like, “Well, what about next month? Do you not appreciate your customers next month?”
Frances Chnaider 28:57
Correct.
Mia Fileman 28:58
It’s so silly.
Let’s talk about marketing Awesome Source. What have been some of your lessons or surprises in this journey?
Frances Chnaider 29:08
Marketing is an interesting one because that is so fundamental to any business.
I really feel that tension, particularly within businesses and corporates where sales versus marketing or the need for marketing is questioned. I’m saying this on a video call where I’m doing quotation marks with my hands for those of you playing at home. That really bothers me, obviously, and I’m sure it bothers you, Mia.
But the reality is that, if you don’t have awareness, you don’t have a brand, you don’t get traffic to your website, people don’t know about you, and there’s no recognition. Ultimately, there’s no sampling, trialling, buying, and repeat buying.
For me, the biggest challenge has been being a brand that’s known – building my awareness. That’s really hard when you’re the owner of the brand because you’re the one that has to stand up, be present, show up, invest in your identity, and invest in your brand’s identity. Not only is that costly financially but it’s a huge energy zap.
For me, awareness is key, and that is something that we’re absolutely working on. Someone called me a baby brand the other day. I get it. I totally get that term that someone else says that about me. I think we are at the beginning of our journey.
That’s lesson one – if you don’t have awareness and people don’t know about you, it’s bloody tricky.
The second one is really about making sure that you’re clear on your brand identity.
We get a lot of feedback about our brand identity, our tone of voice, and really knowing who you are and who you are talking to. Owning that is key because nobody really wants to interact with a brand that is saying very little or isn’t saying something with conviction or authenticity in every category.
I think there are examples of this in non-alcohol, too. There are some beautiful brands and excellent products, but what do you stand for? What are you saying? How are you different? It’s about really owning that.
See, Awesome Source – it’s bold, unapologetic, an extension of you and your awesomeness. Enjoy your awesome at every sip. You are the Awesome Source. No matter who you are, own that, live that, and enjoy that. Let the world enjoy that – that self-love, that high-vibe.
Sometimes, it’s scary to really sit into a strong position, but for me that lesson that taken a while to learn – again, backing it, believing in it, and really delivering on that. Right now, we’re going through a beautiful period of building all of this out and how that looks like visually, how that looks like through content, and how that looks like through packaging.
That’s my biggest second lesson when it comes to marketing. Be known. Be known for something that you’re proud of and that speaks to a certain audience, and fucking own it. Go for it!
Mia Fileman 31:55
Yes, you can’t be half-pregnant. You have to go all in.
Frances Chnaider 31:57
Exactly!
Mia Fileman 32:00
I absolutely love that.
I see that with myself. I’m a marketer in a sea of marketers. You have to find a way to get known for something, and I’m a generalist marketer as well. I can write strategies, I can do content, I can do emails, but I really chose campaigns as being the thing that I wanted people to be like, “Campaigns? Mia.” That has served us incredibly well. It doesn’t mean that we can’t do other things.
It doesn’t mean that Awesome Source can’t evolve to other spirits and other beverages, but I really love how – straight out of the gates – you chose one product and you absolutely nailed the flavour profile, the taste, and the packaging, then that’s going to be that thing that people know you for, recognise you for, that allows you to build a profitable and sustainable business to then launch into other categories.
Frances Chnaider 32:52
I love what you’re saying.
It really reminds me of an MD that I used to work for a long time ago. He said something really interesting that I will never forget. It’s always stayed with me, Mia.
He said that there’s no such thing as a neutral impression. You either leave a positive impression or you leave a negative impression. You have the choice to decide how someone walks away from a conversation with you or from an interaction with you or with your brand.
But it will always fall into either negative or positive because even neutral means that you haven’t delivered on anything great which means that you’re going to be forgotten, you’re not memorable, and they’re not going to engage or not buy. For me, that philosophy is really important.
There is no neutrality.
Mia Fileman 33:35
Yes, there is no impression.
Frances Chnaider 33:37
There is no impression.
Mia Fileman 33:38
Yes, you didn’t leave an impression. I love that.
I had a conversation with a brand earlier this week. I said, “What do you stand for? What are you passionate about? What makes you different?” They said, “You know what? I’m a little bit boring. I’m your average guy. I’m your average girl.” I’m like, “Bleugh. That’s going to bode well.”
Frances Chnaider 33:58
But then own that and find a really interesting way to articulate that that doesn’t make you sound average, but maybe you’re owning an element around the human experience or something.
In my opinion, it’s the idea and the very clear rationale that there’s nothing neutral. It’s A or B.
Mia Fileman 34:21
So good.
With your marketing, how are you planning on riding the momentum around zero-alcohol? Or are you not?
Frances Chnaider 34:30
Another lesson that I learnt early on was not looking too much left and right because that really makes you feel uncomfortable about what everyone else is doing. I’m incredibly impressed anyway with my friends and allies in the category. They’re doing incredible things. I’m also absolutely impressed with the narrative in the media about non-alcohol.
What I’m planning on doing is staying true to who we are and really doubling down or tripling down on building the most beautiful brand, great tasting with bold packaging and flavours, and continuing to colour outside the lines, if you will, in that experience and in this space.
The wave is the wave. The wave is really just beginning. We have probably got another two, three, five, or seven years before non-alcohol is really at the same sales level as alcohol. I am going to continue working on what Awesome Source is about and believing in my customers.
For those that pick me, I 100 percent, unequivocally pick you. With every fibre of my being, I will deliver the most incredible cocktail in a non-alcohol version I can.
Mia Fileman 35:40
I love that. It’s been such a pleasure chatting with you, Frances. Thank you so much!
I’m really excited about this episode because my premonition tells me that Awesome Source is going to be a big deal. I want people to go, “Yes, but she was on Mia’s podcast years ago! Mia saw that. She saw that. She identified it. Now, Frances is a big deal. Ben is a big deal. Awesome Source is a big deal. They were on the ‘Got Marketing?’ podcast first.”
Frances Chnaider 36:09
Yes!
Babe, I feel the same way. It’s part of why I was hesitant to be on this podcast. You’re a big deal. You’re incredible. I see you in the media. I see you delivering the most incredibly interesting and beautiful content, campaigns, and opinions. Equally, ditto.
Ditto, ditto, ditto!
Mia Fileman 36:31
Thank you! Let’s end on mutual appreciation society!
Frances Chnaider 36:34
Yes!
Mia Fileman 36:36
Thank you so much for generously donating your wisdom with us, Frances.
How can people get their hands on a bottle of Awesome Source?
Frances Chnaider 36:45
Absolutely, Mia.
I very much would love you to try Awesome Source. Love it or hate it – that is completely your decision. I will let my packaging and my product do the talking. Hopefully, that speaks to you and your beautiful life. Try Awesome Source at awesomesource.co.
I will absolutely love to give you 10 percent off to sign up for my really sassy, swear-word-laden emails to get that 10 percent off. I will pack a cool little garnish and absolutely overdeliver for you when you order Awesome Source there on the website. There is some cheeky content at awesome.source on IG.
Mia Fileman 37:24
Fantastic!
I will leave all of that below in the show notes.
Thank you once again, Frances! It was such a pleasure!
Frances Chnaider 37:30
Bye everyone! See you soon!
Mia Fileman 37:33
Thank you!
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Podcast reviews are like warm hugs. They’re also the best way to support a small business. You can connect with me, Mia Fileman, on Instagram or LinkedIn. Feel free to send me a message! I’m super friendly.
